Ep 71: Podcast Growth Mistakes and Breaking the Interview Only Myth – with Adam Schaeuble from Podcasting Business School

[00:00:00] Verity: Are you approaching your podcast as an interview only show? Do you panic when you can't find an amazing guest to interview? Hi, I'm Verity and it is great to have you here for this episode of the Lazy Girls Guide to podcasting. In this episode, we are back with Adam from podcasting business school and we are discussing why you don't have to have an interview only podcast. We also dive into other the top mistakes that you could be making as a podcaster that can inhibit your show's growth. Before I get started, I wanted to shout out to Darren, who dropped us a post on Twitter saying, currently listening to at Verity Songon, the Lazy girl's Guide to podcasting. Loads of information and great advice. Thank you. Thank you so much for the amazing review, Darren. Keep them coming in and I might shout you out on a future episode.

[00:00:51] The main mistakes that podcasters are making

[00:00:51] Verity: But now let's dive into the discussion that Adam and I had about the main mistakes that podcasters are making.

[00:00:57] Adam: The basic, basic, basic mistake that I still see a lot of podcasters making is I'm really big on weekly content. You got to give them that weekly reason to show up and get obsessed and addicted to your show. So before we can even talk about marketing an episode, you got to get an episode out there. And I'm a big fan of just finding a way to do it. A lot of people think that podcasting means interviewing only, and that's not the case. You could do solo episodes that are five minute tips. I just did a podcast audit with a woman that has a show called the Curd is the word and it's all about cheese.

[00:01:36] Verity: Oh, my gosh. Yeah, I'm a cheese fanatic. So I'm going to have to go check.

[00:01:40] Adam: You got to check it out. And she only does interviews, and she's doing these really long interviews, and she has a real life job outside of her podcast, which most people do. And she's like, I just don't have time for weekly content. I'm lucky to get one out a month. I was like, how about we get some free cheese and you get weekly episodes? She's like, how do we do this? I go, I want you to reach out to some people that make great cheeses that you would like to taste test. You're going to get those cheeses for free, and you're going to do a five minute review of that cheese as an episode of your show. And she's like, I've never thought of that. And so now she's got all the free cheese that she wants. She's doing these breakdown episodes that are five or ten minutes, and she can get regular content out there. And the reason I feel like this is so important is because podcast listenership and consumption is unique in the content space. It's different than YouTube consumption. It's definitely different than like, email marketing consumption or social media consumption. And that's because people can listen to a podcast and do something else at the same time. Most people aren't watching a YouTube video and mowing their lawn at the same time, or walking their dog or driving. You shouldn't be driving watching YouTube videos for sure. But a podcast, we can insert our content into their life, rhythm and routine. So people listen to podcasting, business school on Tuesdays when they do their midday workout, or where they walk their dog, or their commute from work. And if we don't have weekly content, we give some other show the opportunity to insert themselves into that routine, and we could get kicked out. So once I get that real estate, I want to keep it. So I challenge people to find that way to figure it out, whether maybe you take your interview and break it up into four parts or two parts or whatever, but having weekly consumable content, that's the first part to marketing success. So once we get that, obviously implementing that 72 hours marketing window is a great thing.

[00:03:45]

[00:03:45] Adam: And we talk about mistakes, I think our marketing assets, we have to focus on giving them a reason why they should listen. What's the appetizer? Instead of just telling them to go listen where, like I said, I could put a big old picture of my face on Instagram. Like, new episode, go get it. And that's essentially what a lot of people are doing. New episode just dropped. It's hot. Go get it. And that's not good enough on social media for the most part. So that's definitely a mistake that people are making is what's the compelling reason why they should listen? Honestly, I think another mistake that people are making is that when I post something on social media that's primarily to keep my current listeners listening, that isn't necessarily to go and find new listeners. I do paid ad strategies and guesting strategies like this. I'm sure there are people out there that have never heard of podcasting business school that are listening to this right now. And this is a great opportunity for them to come on over into my world and dive in and swim around in the waters a little bit. Absolutely.

[00:04:52] Verity: Next Tuesday.

[00:04:53] Adam: Yeah, there we go. But when I post on instagram, it's more about people that are already in my world. I want to keep them listening. So think about it through that lens of how is this piece, this picture, or this carousel, or this real? How is that going to intrigue them into this week's topic and get them to go, I really need to go listen to that. So I think thinking through that lens or not thinking through that lens could be a potential mistake that people are making as well.

[00:05:21] Verity: Amazing. I love that.

[00:05:22] Podcasts don't have to be 100% interviews

[00:05:22] Verity: There's a couple of things I want to pick up on that you said then. The first thing was this idea that podcasts don't have to be 100% interviews, because I feel, and I'm happy to be corrected, but I do feel that there's a lot of podcasters, especially new podcasters, who seem to think that they just need to continually interview. I mean, I did something like 58 episodes of this podcast solo before I even got a first guest on the other podcast that I previously did. Lot of interviews, a lot of hard work. Completely agree with your client about the cheese, but no cheese involved for me, which is very sad. But yeah, I think sometimes people can get really bogged down with this idea of, I need somebody to interview, I need an interviewee. And you're like, actually, you don't. You've got enough knowledge in your head, enough opportunities to be able to. I can't even talk. Host a show on yourself. I'm saying host a show on myself. I don't know how I did so many episodes when I can't even get my words out. This is awful, isn't it?

[00:06:22] Creating Marketing Info for New and Current Listeners

[00:06:22] Verity: The other thing that I wanted to pick up on, what you were saying, is just around making sure that when you're creating that marketing info, is it for getting new listeners or is it for your current audience? Because again, I think sometimes in podcasting, we can get so caught up with finding new listeners. But actually, you've got to give your current listeners a reason to come back. It's that whole idea of creating community, which I know is a phrase that just gets so overused in 2024, but it is, you've got to give people a reason to come back. It's same as I like to think about it in terms of, like, when people, or when people, Netflix or whatever, markets my new series of my favorite tv show or something. It's like, how were they drawing me into the next series? Or how are they appealing to me with their new show? If I'm not interested in that 30 seconds or even 10 seconds of the trailer, I'm not going back. So, like you said, it's what value are we offering that is going to keep people coming back to our podcast? I think that's absolute gold.

[00:07:28] Retaining Current Listeners in Podcasting

[00:07:28] Verity: I think if anyone takes nothing else away from this episode, it's what are you doing to retain your current listeners?

[00:07:34] Adam: Yeah, and people talk about it in business all the time, right? What do we hear in business all the time? It is easier to keep a customer than it is to go get a new one. It is less expensive to keep a customer than it is to go and get a new one. Same rule applies to podcast listenership. It is easier and less expensive to keep your audience and build them into superfans. Because superfans go and tell other people.

[00:07:56] Verity: Absolutely.

[00:07:57] Adam: That's still like podcast search is a major way that people find you. SEO and things like that. But podcast recommendations from friends and family still very strong.

[00:08:07] Verity: Absolutely.

[00:08:07] Adam: That's a main way that people find the show still.

[00:08:09] Verity: Yeah, definitely. And I think that gets massively underappreciated. I think we are so used to how the YouTube particular YouTube algorithm works that we kind of forget that Apple podcasts Spotify. The rest of it doesn't work in the same way. And you're right, the power of speech and the power of sharing is so important in podcast discovery. If you have found this episode helpful, then I would love it if you could screenshot you listening to this episode, upload it to Twitter or Instagram Stories, and tag me in at Verity Songon. I'll reshare as many of them as I can. I'm Verity. This is the Lazy Girls Guide to podcasting and I'll see you next episode. Happy podcasting.